Ask Linda 1926-Stroke and distance in a bunker

Dear Linda

Am I correct to believe that option 1 (stroke and distance) as explained in the Diagram 19.3 can only be chosen if the player has not made an attempt to play the ball out of the bunker? Is it also the case that the other 3 options may be used after unsuccessful attempt(s), including in one's score of course the number of attempts made, as well as the penalties?

Our club members look forward to reading your blog!

Regards

Victoria, Australia

Dear Lulu,

Yes.

If your attempt to hit your ball out of the bunker fails (i.e., your ball remains in the bunker), and you decide that your ball is unplayable, you have four relief options:

1. Stroke and distance. For one penalty stroke, drop a ball in the bunker, using the spot of your previous shot in the bunker as the reference point for the one-club-length relief area. The relief area must be in the bunker, since your previous shot was from the bunker.

2. Back-on-the-line relief. For one penalty stroke, drop a ball back on the line in the bunker. Your reference point is behind where your ball now lies.

3. Lateral relief. For one penalty stroke, drop a ball in the bunker within two club-lengths of where the ball now lies. The relief area must be in the bunker, no closer to the hole.

4. Outside the bunker. For a total of two penalty strokes, you may drop a ball back on the line outside  the bunker. Your reference point is outside the bunker on the line that goes straight back from the hole through the spot where your ball now lies.

Please review Rule 19.3 (Relief Options for Unplayable Ball in Bunker) and Rule 14.6 (Making Next Stroke from Where Previous Stroke Made). You may also wish to review Rule 17.2a and the accompanying diagram. This Rule, which applies to penalty areas (notbunkers), allows you to take stroke-and-distance relief from where you made the last stroke outside the penalty area when your attempt to play your ball from a penalty area  remains in the penalty area.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1925-Relief from cart path

Linda,

While playing I took a drop from a cart path. I used my two club-lengths with my 8-iron, that I needed for that shot. I was told by my playing partner that it is a penalty because I did not use my driver. Is this true? 

Lou from Kelowna, British Columbia, Canada

Dear Lou,

No, Lou. That is not true, but your procedure was not correct either. When you have interference from an immovable obstruction (such as a cart path), you must first establish the nearest point of complete relief that is no closer to the hole. You do this by taking a stance and simulating a swing with the club you plan to use for your next shot (an 8-iron, in your case). Once you find this point (called a “reference point"), you will drop the ball in a relief area within one club-length of that point, no closer to the hole. One club-length is defined as the longest club in your bag (other than your putter), but you do not have to measure with that club. If you measure with a shorter club, and your dropped ball rolls beyond the length of that club but within the length of your longest club (had you used that club to measure), the drop is good and the ball is in play.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1924-Place club on ground to help with alignment

Hi Linda, 

On a few occasions in the past I have put my club down on the ground in the direction I was going to hit the ball, lined up, picked up my club and hit the ball. I was told by many pros that this was legal. Is that true still, or did they change the rule this year?

Thank you, 

Lulu from Canton, Georgia

Dear Lulu,

You may no longer place a club on the ground to help line yourself up. You will get the general penalty (loss of hole/two strokes) if you take your stance with the club on the ground, even if you pick it up before you hit. Here is the Rule:

10.2  Advice and Other Help

b. Other Help

(3) No Setting Down Object to Help in Taking Stance. A player must not take a stance for the stroke using any object that was set down by or for the player to help in lining up his or her feet or body, such as a club set down on the ground to show the line of play.

If the player takes a stance in breach of this Rule, he or she cannot avoid penalty by backing away from the stance and removing the object.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1923a-Two follow-ups to 1923 (Ball embedded in wall of bunker)

Dear Linda,  

I have not understood your clarification in paragraph 2 read in conjunction with paragraph 3.

Can you please clarify the following situation:

The ball is embedded in the greenside wall of the bunker. Am I correct in understanding that, if in this situation, free relief (one club-length) is not available, not closer to the hole, one can drop on the flag line behind the bunker? If not, how does one proceed?

Regards,

Lou from Pune, India

Dear Lou,

There is no free relief available if your ball is embedded at the very base of a bunker wall made of soil, grass, turf, or artificial material if neither the reference point (which must be right behind the ball in the case of an embedded ball) nor any part of the course within one club-length of that spot is in the general area [Clarification from December, 2018].

If you decide that you cannot play the ball, you may declare it unplayable, in which case you must add one penalty stroke to your score and choose one of these relief options: (1) play a ball from where you played your previous shot, (2) drop a ball back on the line, or (3) drop a ball within two club-lengths of where it lies [see Rule 19.2 for all the particulars]. If you choose back-on-the-line relief, you may drop anywhere on the reference line behind your ball, in any area  of the course, which would include both in and behind (outside) the bunker. 

Dear Linda,

In your last statement that you are not entitled to relief if the ball is embedded just above the sand but does not allow relief with the relief rules, do you drop it in the sand with no penalty?

Lou from Ontario, Canada

Dear Lou,

No. 

You may declare your ball unplayable and drop it back on the line in the bunker, but you will get a one-stroke penalty for taking unplayable relief under Rule 19.2.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1923-Ball embedded in wall of bunker

Dear Linda,

At a recent rules workshop a presenter stated that free relief was given for an embedded ball in the wall of a bunker. As I read it, relief may only be taken if the wall of the bunker is not sand. All the walls of bunkers on our course are sand.

I would appreciate your clarification.

Lulu from Australia

Dear Lulu,

Your understanding is correct.

You are only entitled to free relief if your ball is embedded in the general area [Rule 16.3a(1)]. Bunker walls that are sand are part of the bunker. No free relief is available for a ball embedded in sand in a bunker, as bunkers are not in the general area

The rules workshop presenter was referring to bunker walls that consist of soil, grass, stacked turf, or artificial materials. Such walls are not part of the bunker. They are in the general area, and free relief is available for an embedded ball.

Please note this clarification that was published in December 2018:

If your ball is embedded at the very base of a bunker wall that is not sand, the spot right behind the ball is in the bunker, and no part of the relief area not closer to the hole and within one club-length of that spot (or reference point) is in the general area, you are not entitled to free relief.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1922-MLR E-5; accidentally move ball; ACC in penalty area

Hey there,

My club is in controversy.

New OB ruling: Does your golf course have to OK the new ruling of distance and strokes? Or can the ladies organization on their own decide to play new rule?

Second new rule:

Tell me where to find this please: 

Ball in play off the tee... hit ball by accident taking a practice swing on fairway. Has that changed? Put ball back, no penalty?

Final! Burrowing animal hole in penalty area. Know you can move lots of things now, how about burrowing animal holes?

Thanks for your help.

Lulu from Palm Desert, California

Dear Lulu,

1. If you are referring to Model Local Rule E-5, the ladies’ organization may decide to adopt that Local Rule for league play.

2. Once a ball is in play, if the player accidentally moves her ball (with a practice swing or otherwise), she gets one penalty stroke and must replace the ball. There are Exceptions, most notably on the putting green. Please read Rule 9.4b.

3. There is no free relief from abnormal course conditions in a penalty area. See Rule 16.1a(2).

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1921-Use a massaging tool during round

Hi Linda, 

Great blog :-)

I golf competitively in NCGA [Northern California Golf Association] and other scratch events. I am getting a little older, 40 now, and have been suffering recently from forearm tightness. I have a great massage tool/stick I use. May I have it in my bag and use it during a competitive round?

Thank you,

Lou from Oakland, California

Dear Lou,

Yes.

Rule 4.3a(6) allows you to use any equipment designed for stretching. In my opinion, massaging would come under the general heading of “stretching”; a massaging tool would therefore be permitted.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1920-Requirement to search for unplayable ball

Hi Linda,

As a high handicapper, occasionally I will miss-hit my tee shot and end up with the ball 10 feet in front of me in a clump of long grass.

I know I can declare the ball unplayable and re-tee the shot for a penalty of one stroke but do I need to actually find the ball first, or can I just declare it unplayable and then look for it after the re-tee? Obviously if I find it I would just pick it up and continue with the replacement ball.

Thanks,

Lou from Royal Wootton Bassett, UK

Dear Lou,

There is no requirement to find your ball when you choose the stroke-and-distance relief option for an unplayable ball [Rule 19.2]. 

If you were to choose either the back-on-the-line or lateral relief options, you would have to know the spot of the original ball.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1919-Putt ball into hole on top of another ball

Hi Linda,

RULE 11.1: Exception – Ball Played on Putting Green in Stroke Play: If the player’s ball in motion hits another ball at rest on the putting green and both balls were on the putting green before the stroke, the player gets the general penalty (two penalty strokes).

Before 2019 the same rule said that the other ball should be "in play".

My Question is if you are putting your ball into the hole before another player has taken up her ball from the hole, do you get a penalty or is the inside of the hole not "on the putting green"?

Thanks,

Lou from Kumla, Sweden

Dear Lou,

There is no penalty if a player putts his ball into the hole while another ball (or two!) is at rest in the hole. A ball in the hole is below the surface of the putting green, not on it [Definition of “Holed”], and is no longer in play [Definition of “In Play”].

Some players prefer that the hole be empty; others don’t care. I belong to the latter group – anything to speed up play.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1918-Ball thought in lake later found

Linda,

My partner hit a shot towards a lake. He didn’t look for it, saying it was in the lake. He dropped a ball   under penalty of stroke and distance and continued play. 100 yards later the ball was found, on the fairway, had obviously bounced off a rock. Which ball was in play?

Thanks ,

Lulu from Edinburgh, Scotland

Dear Lulu,

The second ball (the ball the player dropped) was his ball in play. 

As soon as the player dropped another ball, that ball became his ball in play under penalty of stroke and distance and his original was officially lost under the Rules.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1917-Disqualify player and marker for failure to hole out

Hi Linda,

There is a well-established culture of "gimmes" in our club and this has extended beyond casual groups into stroke play competitions. In order to eradicate this we included in the local rules for a Stableford competition the following:

"There are no gimmes in stroke play (and Stableford) competitions. If the hole is not completed the score does not count. Penalty- disqualification in stroke play and no score for the hole in Stableford."

Despite this, several players continued to offer and accept "gimmes".

We disqualified those who took "gimmes" on the grounds that they signed for an incorrect score and the markers for knowingly signing an incorrect card.

There was some discussion as to whether the marker should be disqualified or not and whether the player should be penalised only for each hole he failed to complete.

It certainly made players aware of the problem.

Would you kindly comment.

Regards,

Lou from France

Dear Lou,

The player in a regular stroke play competition who fails to hole out must be disqualified [Rule 3.3c]. A marker who knowingly certifies an incorrect scorecard should also be disqualified under Rule 1.2a, Serious Misconduct [Interpretation 3.3b(1)/1].

If the stroke play competition is a Stableford, a player who does not hole out (for whatever reason) gets zero points for the hole, but is not disqualified from the competition [Rule 21.1b(1)]. However, if the player signs a scorecard that includes a score that would give him points on a hole (or holes) where he did not hole out, the player is disqualified [Rules 3.3b(3) and 21.1b(2)]. It is my opinion that a marker who certifies that incorrect card should also be disqualified. 

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1916-Preferred lies

Linda,

When allowed by local rule to mark and replace ball 6 inches/card length/one club-length, etc., can you place the ball on the green if inside the deemed length and no nearer the hole?

Lou from the UK

Dear Lou,

No. You may not move a ball that is not on the putting green onto the green via preferred lies.

I have copied the Model Local Rule for preferred lies below for you from the R&A website. Note in particular that it states that the relief area must be in the general area. The putting green is not in the general area.

Model Local Rule E-3

"When a player's ball lies in a part of the general area cut to fairway height or less [or identify a specific area such as 'on the fairway of the 6th hole'], the player may take free relief once by placing the original ball or another ball in and playing it from this relief area: 

• Reference Point: Spot of the original ball. 
• Size of Relief Area Measured from Reference Point: [Specify size of relief area, such as one club-length, one scorecard length or 6 inches] from the reference point, but with these limits: 
• Limits on Location of Relief Area: 
• Must not be nearer the hole than the reference point, and 
• Must be in the general area. 

In proceeding under this Local Rule, the player must choose a spot to place the ball and use the procedures for replacing a ball under Rules 14.2b(2) and 14.2e.

Penalty for Playing Ball from a Wrong Place in Breach of Local Rule: General Penalty Under Rule 14.7a."

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1915-Unplayable ball still unplayable after drop

Hi Linda,

I have a situation that I hope you could provide an answer to. It is like this:

I had two rounds of golf recently where the fairways were in poor condition. There were two occasions where my ball ended in a ledge with a downhill lie and there is just no way for my club head to contact the ball. My options on both occasions were to declare the ball unplayable and accept a penalty stroke, but assuming I took this option and had the ball dropped but it rolled into the same spot or a similar situation, what are my options? Re-drop without another penalty or with a penalty? 

Please advise.

Best regards,

Lou from Johore, Malaysia

Dear Lou,

Assuming the ball has come to rest in the relief area, you will have to re-drop if your ball is still unplayable, adding another penalty stroke to your score. Please choose your relief option and your relief area with great care. 

I would think that the course might want to consider implementing Preferred Lies in the fairways if conditions are that poor.

Here is the interpretation that addresses your question:

19.2/1 – No Guarantee Ball Will Be Playable After Taking Unplayable Ball Relief

When taking unplayable ball relief, a player must accept the outcome even if it is unfavourable, such as when a dropped ball comes to rest in its original location or in a bad lie in another location in the relief area:

·       Once the dropped ball comes to rest in the relief area, the player has a new situation.

·       If the player decides that he or she cannot (or does not wish to) play the ball as it now lies, the player may again take unplayable ball relief, for an additional penalty, using any available relief option under Rule 19.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1914-Reach across hole to tap in putt

Hi Linda,

Is this tapping in while standing across the line of play permissible? 

Where, in the rules book?

Regards,

Lou from Thailand

Dear Lou,

Yes.

You may stand on the opposite side of the hole and reach over to tap your ball into the hole, provided you fairly strike at the ball. This means that there is only momentary contact between the club and the ball, and you do not push, scrape, or scoop the ball [Rule 10.1a].

The line of play is the line where the player intends his or her ball to go after a stroke [Definition of “Line of Play”]. So in your diagram, you are not violating the Rule against standing on the line of play if you are standing on the opposite side of the hole [Rule 10.1c].

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1913-Two balls in motion collide

Hello Linda,

A lot of people in our golf club know that I am always studying the golf rules as much as possible. Some say I am exaggerating (which I firmly disagree), while others appreciate it a lot.

I recently bought the new edition Official Guide to the Rules of Golf and cannot find the item that I want to be cleared.

A friend of mine played match play (MP) with another lady. End this month we have our Belgian National Championship MP [match play].

One of them Mrs. C was in the deep bunker left of the green while the other one Mrs. J was in the deep bunker right of the green. Bunkers were so deep that C could not see J and J could not see C.

What happened: you’ll never believe it…. they both played their ball at the same time and balls met/touched each other up in the air.

Can you please tell me the ruling here… play your ball as it lies or???? In match play and stroke play please.

I am always so fascinated reading your answers, which I tell and explain to some of my good golf friends and they are now looking forward to hear your good news.

I tried to find the solution in the new edition but could not. I may have overlooked it?

I do hope my English is understandable???

A thousand thanks and hope reading you soonest.

Kindest regards from the Flemish part of Belgium.

Lulu from Belgium

Dear Lulu,

There is no penalty to either player and both balls must be played as they lie. Please read Rule 11.1a and 11.1b, keeping in mind that each player’s ball is an outside influence in relation to the other ball.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1912-Accidentally move ball in general area

Hello Linda,

Now that the USGA has relaxed some of the rules, I question myself when asked about some of the rules. Situation: Player taking practice swings for her approach shot actually hits the ball. Now what? If I understand correctly, if this happened on the putting green she would put her ball back, but what if it was anywhere else in the general area?

Thank you,

Lulu from South Carolina

Dear Lulu,

You are correct in your understanding that there is no penalty on the putting green if the player accidentally moves her ball while she takes a practice swing [Rule 13.1d]. The ball must be replaced.

Elsewhere, the penalty for accidentally moving your ball in play is one stroke and the ball must be replaced. If the player fails to replace the ball, the penalty escalates to the general penalty (loss of hole/two strokes) [Rule 9.4b].

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1911-Incorrect Local Rule

Dear Linda

Firstly, thank you for all your hard work on our behalf, very much appreciated!

I have been tasked with typing up Local Rules, one of which reads as follows:

“Hole No. 6 (Men's) – A provisional ball may be played if you think that your tee shot has gone out of bounds or may be lost in the penalty area.

If the first ball is found then this is the ball in play.”

I am not sure about this and would like to be before I question it. It is my understanding that a provisional ball cannot be played if one believes the original ball to be lost in a Penalty Areaand that if one did play another ball then that ball would be the ball in play.

This is a blind shot for the men, it is therefore entirely possible that their tee shot could be O.O.B. or lost outside the Penalty Area.

Thanking you in anticipation,

Kind regards,

Lulu from England

Dear Lulu,

A player may hit a provisional ball if his ball might be lost outside  a penalty area or be out of bounds. He may hit a provisional ball for a ball that might be lost in a penalty area provided it also  might be lost outside the penalty area [Rule 18.3a].

I am going to assume that the ground adjacent to the penalty area is such that a ball might be difficult to find there. Since this is a blind shot, the player would be permitted to hit a provisional ball for a ball that might be lost in the penalty area, as it might also be lost outside the penalty area. 

If it is known or virtually certain that the ball is in a penalty area (not the case here), the player is not permitted to play a provisional ball. In this circumstance, the so-called provisional ball would be the ball in play under penalty of stroke and distance, as you suggest.

If you want to correct this “Local Rule” (I will explain the use of quotes shortly), change “may be lost in the penalty area” to “may be lost in the penalty area or somewhere else on the course.” However, there is no need at all for this “Local Rule,” since the use of a provisional ball in this situation is allowed under the Rules.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1910-Drop from shoulder height

Linda,

A friend asked the following and I’m pretty sure I know the answer with Rickie Fowler having done the same just recently.

But friend asks: 

After hitting 2^nd shot out of bounds (from the fairway) a drop was taken incorrectly at shoulder height (at the correct relief area).

The hole was completed and the incorrect action was only identified at end of the next hole.

Penalty in stroke play? Penalty in match play?

In match play, if the opponent saw the drop being made from the wrong height but did not say anything until the hole was completed knowing he would automatically win the hole, is the opponent breaching any rule for deliberately allowing a breach of the rules?

Lou from Wellington, New Zealand

Dear Lou,

The player must drop the ball from knee height. If he drops from shoulder height, he has dropped in a wrong way. If he does not correct his mistake, he gets one penalty stroke (in both match play and stroke play) if he plays the ball from within the correct relief area. If he plays the ball from outside the correct relief area, he gets the general penalty [Rule 14.3b(3)]. The general penalty is loss of hole in match play, two strokes in stroke play.

Regarding your second question, there is no Rule that requires a player in a match to warn his opponent that he is about to breach a Rule other than common decency. Some match players are comfortable withholding information that would help their opponent avoid a penalty. I am not. I prefer to teach my opponent than profit from his ignorance.

A player may choose to ignore his opponent’s breach of a Rule in match play. If he does so, there is no penalty, provided there is no agreement to ignore a breach. (“Agreement” would go something like this: “I saw you drop from the wrong height back there, but I do not want to call a penalty on you, so let’s agree to ignore it and play on, OK with you?” “Yes.”) If the player decides not to ignore the breach and his opponent does not agree with the penalty, the player must request a ruling about the incorrect drop before either player makes a stroke on the next hole. 

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.

Ask Linda 1909-Center flagstick in hole

Dear Linda,

Frequently the flagstick is found to be leaning in one direction, usually because of a strong wind, or sometimes because the apparatus to hold the flagstick in the hole is faulty. But the player may prefer to leave the flag in.

In some of our social games, in such a circumstance, if the flagstick direction is against the player, other players will centre the flagstick and hold it in place. Am I right in believing this is illegal? Is a penalty applied only if the ball hits the flagstick? And if so would the penalty fall on the person holding the flagstick, if there was no explicit request from the player?

What if this act was performed by another caddie, or a third party such as a spectator?

Thank you as always,

Lou from the UK

Dear Lou,

A player may elect to leave the flagstick in the hole when he putts. If it is not centered, he may choose to leave it as it is or center it. If the flagstick will not remain centered, and the angle will disadvantage the player, the player may decide to have the flagstick removed or attended.

If someone has been asked to attend the flagstick, that person may hold it in, above, or next to the hole to show the player where the hole is, and then remove it once the stroke has been made. If he is holding the flagstick in the hole, he may hold it centered.

If the person attending the flagstick deliberately fails to remove it after the player putts, and the ball subsequently hits the flagstick, that person (if he is a player or a player’s caddie) will get the general penalty (two strokes/loss of hole). To clarify, if your caddie deliberately allows your ball to hit the flagstick, you get the general penalty; if another player or his caddie does the same, that player gets the general penalty [Rule 13.2b(2)]. The stroke does not count. The original ball or another ball must be replaced on the original spot and the player will replay the putt [Rule 11.2c].

There is no penalty to anyone if the ball does not hit a flagstick that has been deliberately held in the hole.

Linda

Copyright © 2019 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.