Hi again Linda. I have studied your response, and I wonder if you would be kind enough to give me a further opinion. Yes I agree we should have voiced an objection at the time. Alas we did not do so out of ignorance. My partner and I are new golfers, and were unaware of the rules when applied to a unilateral concession of a putt. Do you think there are grounds for a post match objection on the basis that the opposing player (a very experienced 6 Handicap) infringed the rules by attempting to invalidate a conceded putt and getting away with it, knowing full well that it was not allowed?
Thank you so much for your earliest convenient reply.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
You and your partner lost the option to file a claim as soon as any player in the match teed off on the next hole. A Committee will not consider a later claim unless the facts were previously unknown to you and you had been given wrong information by your opponent.
Don’t assume that just because your opponent was an experienced golfer with a single digit handicap that he was actually aware he was breaking the rules by withdrawing the concession. A good working knowledge of the rules is often more a matter of attention and interest than experience. If he did indeed know that he was not permitted to withdraw his partner’s concession, then he is violating the spirit and integrity of the game.
Knowing the rules can save strokes during your round, and can even help you win a match (as you have ruefully discovered). All golfers, both new and experienced, should take some time to study and learn the rules. You will find it to be time well spent.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Tuesday, November 30, 2010
Monday, November 29, 2010
Ask Linda #259-Conceding a putt
Hi. Please be so kind as to give an opinion on the following situation.
On the 17th hole, scores were level, when one of our opponents had clearly "given" an 8-10 inch putt in full hearing of the 5 people present (including the match referee). The opponent in question was standing at the flag, together with the match referee, when the ball came to a stop. Before any of our players had time to reach the hole to pick up the ball, our other opponent negated the "gimme" and said he would like the putt played. The match referee remained silent. Our player walked up to the ball, and subsequently missed the putt, which would have halved the hole.
We then halved the 18th, and lost the match by one hole.
My questions are twofold:
1. Was opponent #2 entitled to override opponent #1’s clear "gimme"?
Concession of next stroke, hole or match (Rule 2-4): "When the opponent's ball is at rest or is deemed to be at rest under Rule 16-2, the player may concede the opponent to have holed out with his next stroke and the ball may be removed by either side with a club or otherwise. A player may concede a hole or a match at any time prior to the conclusion of the hole or the match. Concession of a stroke, hole or match may not be declined or withdrawn."
2. What role does a match referee play when a putt is clearly given? Does the match referee have the right/duty to inform the players that the putt has been given?
Referee: The referee is one who is appointed by the Committee to accompany players to decide questions of fact and apply the Rules. He shall act on any breach of a Rule that he observes or is reported to him. A referee's decision is final.
Thank you for your comments.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
I fail to understand why players in matches have trouble with the basic and clearly stated rule that “a concession may not be declined or withdrawn” [Rule 2-4]. If the player’s putt is conceded, then the hole is over for him. He cannot refuse the concession, and neither his opponent nor his opponent’s partner may withdraw the concession. If he attempts the putt after the concession and misses, the putt was still “good.”
The only problem that may be created by putting a ball after the putt was conceded is the possibility that the putt may assist the player’s partner. Should that happen, then the partner loses the hole [Decision 2-4/6]. I always advise players who wish to try an already-conceded putt to lift their ball when it is conceded, wait until play on the hole has finished, and then replace the ball and try the putt.
The referee’s primary responsibility is to answer questions about the rules when asked. When he heard the concession, and then the illegal withdrawal of the concession, he was probably waiting for the team that lost the hole to file a claim. Had they done so, he would have been able to rule on the spot that the putt was indeed conceded, and the concession could not be withdrawn. Since no question was asked, and no objection to the result of the hole was raised, the referee was under no obligation to correct the players’ error. He does not want to be seen as favoring one player or team over another.
If you are playing a match without a referee, and you believe a rule has been breached, you have the option to file a claim. You must do so before any player in the match tees off on the next hole. You will bring this claim to the Committee at the end of the round for a ruling.
If you are lucky enough to have a referee accompanying your match, don’t ever hesitate to ask for an immediate ruling on a disputed procedure. It is his job to assist you with the rules. He will give you a ruling if asked, and his decision will be final.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
On the 17th hole, scores were level, when one of our opponents had clearly "given" an 8-10 inch putt in full hearing of the 5 people present (including the match referee). The opponent in question was standing at the flag, together with the match referee, when the ball came to a stop. Before any of our players had time to reach the hole to pick up the ball, our other opponent negated the "gimme" and said he would like the putt played. The match referee remained silent. Our player walked up to the ball, and subsequently missed the putt, which would have halved the hole.
We then halved the 18th, and lost the match by one hole.
My questions are twofold:
1. Was opponent #2 entitled to override opponent #1’s clear "gimme"?
Concession of next stroke, hole or match (Rule 2-4): "When the opponent's ball is at rest or is deemed to be at rest under Rule 16-2, the player may concede the opponent to have holed out with his next stroke and the ball may be removed by either side with a club or otherwise. A player may concede a hole or a match at any time prior to the conclusion of the hole or the match. Concession of a stroke, hole or match may not be declined or withdrawn."
2. What role does a match referee play when a putt is clearly given? Does the match referee have the right/duty to inform the players that the putt has been given?
Referee: The referee is one who is appointed by the Committee to accompany players to decide questions of fact and apply the Rules. He shall act on any breach of a Rule that he observes or is reported to him. A referee's decision is final.
Thank you for your comments.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
I fail to understand why players in matches have trouble with the basic and clearly stated rule that “a concession may not be declined or withdrawn” [Rule 2-4]. If the player’s putt is conceded, then the hole is over for him. He cannot refuse the concession, and neither his opponent nor his opponent’s partner may withdraw the concession. If he attempts the putt after the concession and misses, the putt was still “good.”
The only problem that may be created by putting a ball after the putt was conceded is the possibility that the putt may assist the player’s partner. Should that happen, then the partner loses the hole [Decision 2-4/6]. I always advise players who wish to try an already-conceded putt to lift their ball when it is conceded, wait until play on the hole has finished, and then replace the ball and try the putt.
The referee’s primary responsibility is to answer questions about the rules when asked. When he heard the concession, and then the illegal withdrawal of the concession, he was probably waiting for the team that lost the hole to file a claim. Had they done so, he would have been able to rule on the spot that the putt was indeed conceded, and the concession could not be withdrawn. Since no question was asked, and no objection to the result of the hole was raised, the referee was under no obligation to correct the players’ error. He does not want to be seen as favoring one player or team over another.
If you are playing a match without a referee, and you believe a rule has been breached, you have the option to file a claim. You must do so before any player in the match tees off on the next hole. You will bring this claim to the Committee at the end of the round for a ruling.
If you are lucky enough to have a referee accompanying your match, don’t ever hesitate to ask for an immediate ruling on a disputed procedure. It is his job to assist you with the rules. He will give you a ruling if asked, and his decision will be final.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Monday, November 22, 2010
Ask Linda #258-Provisional hits original
A player suspects his ball could be out of bounds and hits a provisional ball. People on an adjoining fairway saw that his provisional ball hit his first ball. Is he penalized for hitting his own equipment?
Thank you
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
There is no penalty for hitting your original ball with your provisional ball [Decision 18-5/2]. If the original ball was moved when it was hit, and the observers on the adjacent fairway are able to point out the spot where the ball lay prior to being hit, then the original ball must be replaced.
If you were unaware that your original ball was moved, you played it where it lay, and someone later informed you that it had been hit and moved by your provisional, there is no penalty for not having replaced your ball.
If you’re looking for some rationale as to why there is no penalty, see if this works for you. Since a provisional ball does not meet the definition of “equipment” [Section II: Definitions], you have not moved your original ball with your own equipment. It is also not in play in this case, since you have found your original ball and are now required to abandon the provisional. I would venture to say that a provisional ball would be treated like an “outside agency” until it becomes the ball in play. It is not in play until either your original ball is lost and you continue play with the provisional, or you hit the provisional from where the original is likely to be or from a spot closer to the hole than that area.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Thank you
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
There is no penalty for hitting your original ball with your provisional ball [Decision 18-5/2]. If the original ball was moved when it was hit, and the observers on the adjacent fairway are able to point out the spot where the ball lay prior to being hit, then the original ball must be replaced.
If you were unaware that your original ball was moved, you played it where it lay, and someone later informed you that it had been hit and moved by your provisional, there is no penalty for not having replaced your ball.
If you’re looking for some rationale as to why there is no penalty, see if this works for you. Since a provisional ball does not meet the definition of “equipment” [Section II: Definitions], you have not moved your original ball with your own equipment. It is also not in play in this case, since you have found your original ball and are now required to abandon the provisional. I would venture to say that a provisional ball would be treated like an “outside agency” until it becomes the ball in play. It is not in play until either your original ball is lost and you continue play with the provisional, or you hit the provisional from where the original is likely to be or from a spot closer to the hole than that area.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Thursday, November 18, 2010
Ask Linda #257-Object indicates line of play
Hi Linda,
We have not corresponded in a while but I always look forward to your rules posts. Hope everything is well with you and your family.
An interesting situation occurred this weekend concerning an "object indicting line of play". As I was preparing to place my tee in the ground I notice that someone from a previous group had left their tee in the ground. I mentioned to my playing partner that I was going to use it as an alignment aid so I teed my ball a few feet behind it on a line that I intended my ball to take. My playing partner said that he was unsure if that was permissible and referred to Rule 8 - "Advice; Indicating Line of Play". I told him that is my understanding that an object cannot be "placed" to indicate the line (8-2a). However, there is no rule against using an object that is already there. The same would hold true if there was a leaf or a twig or anything else that was already there when you go to the teeing ground and you lined up with that object (or if you used a house or a tree in the distance to line up with).
What do you think? Am I OK?
Thanks,
Lou Lou from Atlanta
Dear Lou Lou,
Always nice to hear from you, Lou. And I have good news for you. You are OK. You may use anything that is already there to help you line up your shot – leaves, twigs, trees, houses, abandoned tees, etc. Additionally, you are permitted to place a mark to indicate your line of play as long as you pick it up before you hit the ball.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
We have not corresponded in a while but I always look forward to your rules posts. Hope everything is well with you and your family.
An interesting situation occurred this weekend concerning an "object indicting line of play". As I was preparing to place my tee in the ground I notice that someone from a previous group had left their tee in the ground. I mentioned to my playing partner that I was going to use it as an alignment aid so I teed my ball a few feet behind it on a line that I intended my ball to take. My playing partner said that he was unsure if that was permissible and referred to Rule 8 - "Advice; Indicating Line of Play". I told him that is my understanding that an object cannot be "placed" to indicate the line (8-2a). However, there is no rule against using an object that is already there. The same would hold true if there was a leaf or a twig or anything else that was already there when you go to the teeing ground and you lined up with that object (or if you used a house or a tree in the distance to line up with).
What do you think? Am I OK?
Thanks,
Lou Lou from Atlanta
Dear Lou Lou,
Always nice to hear from you, Lou. And I have good news for you. You are OK. You may use anything that is already there to help you line up your shot – leaves, twigs, trees, houses, abandoned tees, etc. Additionally, you are permitted to place a mark to indicate your line of play as long as you pick it up before you hit the ball.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Monday, November 15, 2010
Ask Linda #256-Practice swing in nearby bunker
A player's ball is in a bunker. There is another bunker, a few steps away. He steps into the other bunker and takes a practice swing, striking the sand. Has he broken a rule?
Thank you
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
Yes, Lou. The player has broken Rule 13-4a, which states that a player may not test the condition of a bunker or any similar bunker before he hits a ball that is in a bunker. This rule applies to any water hazard or bunker. The penalty is loss of hole in match play, two strokes in stroke play.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Thank you
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
Yes, Lou. The player has broken Rule 13-4a, which states that a player may not test the condition of a bunker or any similar bunker before he hits a ball that is in a bunker. This rule applies to any water hazard or bunker. The penalty is loss of hole in match play, two strokes in stroke play.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Thursday, November 11, 2010
Ask Linda #255-Stepping on ball
My ball in play was lost in thick rough which was all covered by newly mowed grass. While searching, I accidentally stepped on a ball. Upon verification (without touching) I saw that it was my ball (with my marker clearly seen), however, it was embedded due to me stepping onto it. Questions (1) Is there a penalty for stepping on my ball while searching? (2) If it is embedded due to me stepping on it, am I entitled to relief without penalty? (3) If not, can I declare unplayable and take a one-stroke penalty? Appreciate your comments. Thank you
Regards,
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
When you step on your ball and push it into the ground you incur a one-stroke penalty for moving your ball in play under Rule 18-2a. Since the original lie of the ball is altered (it wasn’t embedded until you stepped on it), you must place it in the nearest spot that is most similar to your original lie that is within one club-length of your original lie [Rule 20-3b].
There is no penalty if you move another player’s ball in the process of searching for it. If that happens, the ball must be replaced.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Regards,
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
When you step on your ball and push it into the ground you incur a one-stroke penalty for moving your ball in play under Rule 18-2a. Since the original lie of the ball is altered (it wasn’t embedded until you stepped on it), you must place it in the nearest spot that is most similar to your original lie that is within one club-length of your original lie [Rule 20-3b].
There is no penalty if you move another player’s ball in the process of searching for it. If that happens, the ball must be replaced.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Monday, November 8, 2010
Ask Linda #254-Lifting another's ball
Hi Linda,
In a two player better ball match play tournament, the following situation occurred. The competition was being held under preferred lies (lift, clean, and place) due to wet conditions. Two balls lay in the fairway. Player A marked a ball, picked it up, and was cleaning the ball as he walked about 10 yards forward to check a sprinkler head for yardage. While doing this Player A realized the ball he had picked up belonged to Player B. Player A returned the ball to the place where it had lain and walked away. Player B noticed what had happened and asked player A if he had picked up the wrong ball and he replied “yes.” Does Player A incur a penalty for picking up the ball that belonged to Player B?
Thank you.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
Yes. Playing preferred lies does not affect other Rules of Golf. Simply because a player is permitted to lift, clean, and place his own ball does not mean he is permitted to do the same to his opponent’s ball. In match play, if a player moves an opponent’s ball, the penalty is one stroke, and the ball must be replaced [Rule 18-3b]. In stroke play, there is no penalty [Rule 18-4].
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
In a two player better ball match play tournament, the following situation occurred. The competition was being held under preferred lies (lift, clean, and place) due to wet conditions. Two balls lay in the fairway. Player A marked a ball, picked it up, and was cleaning the ball as he walked about 10 yards forward to check a sprinkler head for yardage. While doing this Player A realized the ball he had picked up belonged to Player B. Player A returned the ball to the place where it had lain and walked away. Player B noticed what had happened and asked player A if he had picked up the wrong ball and he replied “yes.” Does Player A incur a penalty for picking up the ball that belonged to Player B?
Thank you.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
Yes. Playing preferred lies does not affect other Rules of Golf. Simply because a player is permitted to lift, clean, and place his own ball does not mean he is permitted to do the same to his opponent’s ball. In match play, if a player moves an opponent’s ball, the penalty is one stroke, and the ball must be replaced [Rule 18-3b]. In stroke play, there is no penalty [Rule 18-4].
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Thursday, November 4, 2010
Ask Linda #253-Penalty for one or two?
Hi Linda,
In a 2-player better ball, match play competition, if one player violates a rule where the penalty is loss of hole, does the team lose the hole or is the player that violated the rule out of the hole and the other player allowed to continue and represent the team on that hole?
Thank you.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
1. If one player hits a wrong ball (even if it is his partner's ball), the player is disqualified from the hole but his partner incurs no penalty.
2. Both players will lose the hole if either one breaches Rule 4 (Clubs), Rule 6-4 (Caddie), or any Local Rule or Condition of the Competition where the penalty involves an adjustment to the state of the match.
a. An example of a breach of Rule 4 would be if one player started the round with more than 14 clubs.
b. The caddie rule would be breached if a player were to use more than one caddie at any given time.
c. An example of a violation of a Condition of the Competition would be if a player were found to be using different brands when a one ball condition was in effect.
3. If one player breaches a rule that assists his partner's play or adversely affects an opponent's play, both the player and the partner are penalized. For example, if a player picks up a loose impediment in a bunker, he is disqualified from the hole. If his partner is also in the bunker, and lifting the loose impediment assists the partner’s play, then the partner is also disqualified from the hole.
4. In all other cases where a player's violation causes him to lose a hole, the penalty applies to the player only, and not his partner.
This information can be found in Rule 30-3, Four-Ball Match Play. “Four-ball” is the official designation for what is more commonly called “better ball,” or “better ball of partners.”
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
In a 2-player better ball, match play competition, if one player violates a rule where the penalty is loss of hole, does the team lose the hole or is the player that violated the rule out of the hole and the other player allowed to continue and represent the team on that hole?
Thank you.
Lou Lou
Dear Lou Lou,
1. If one player hits a wrong ball (even if it is his partner's ball), the player is disqualified from the hole but his partner incurs no penalty.
2. Both players will lose the hole if either one breaches Rule 4 (Clubs), Rule 6-4 (Caddie), or any Local Rule or Condition of the Competition where the penalty involves an adjustment to the state of the match.
a. An example of a breach of Rule 4 would be if one player started the round with more than 14 clubs.
b. The caddie rule would be breached if a player were to use more than one caddie at any given time.
c. An example of a violation of a Condition of the Competition would be if a player were found to be using different brands when a one ball condition was in effect.
3. If one player breaches a rule that assists his partner's play or adversely affects an opponent's play, both the player and the partner are penalized. For example, if a player picks up a loose impediment in a bunker, he is disqualified from the hole. If his partner is also in the bunker, and lifting the loose impediment assists the partner’s play, then the partner is also disqualified from the hole.
4. In all other cases where a player's violation causes him to lose a hole, the penalty applies to the player only, and not his partner.
This information can be found in Rule 30-3, Four-Ball Match Play. “Four-ball” is the official designation for what is more commonly called “better ball,” or “better ball of partners.”
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Wednesday, November 3, 2010
Vacation notice
Dear readers,
I will be out of the country during the month of November. Please continue to send your questions, but be aware that I will not be able to send you an answer until December.
Don’t be confused by the fact that you will continue receiving my columns during November. While I send personal answers to readers as soon as possible after receiving them, I don’t post those answers immediately. I prefer to post no more than two answers per week on the blog.
Happy Thanksgiving!
Linda
I will be out of the country during the month of November. Please continue to send your questions, but be aware that I will not be able to send you an answer until December.
Don’t be confused by the fact that you will continue receiving my columns during November. While I send personal answers to readers as soon as possible after receiving them, I don’t post those answers immediately. I prefer to post no more than two answers per week on the blog.
Happy Thanksgiving!
Linda
Monday, November 1, 2010
Ask Linda #252-Reach over hole to tap in putt
Hi Linda,
Situation: Player 'just misses' her putt. She reaches her putter over the hole and taps the ball in the hole. The ball moves toward her, as she has not moved from the side of the hole from which she originally putted. Our Pro says that is OK. Some of us "older" Gals remember that being against the rules. What do you think? Thanks for this and all the other great explanations you have published! Lulu
Dear Lulu,
Your pro is correct, Lulu. While it is true that a player is not permitted to putt a ball while straddling the line of putt (the “line of putt” is the path you expect the ball to take on the way to the hole), or while standing on the line of putt [Rule 16-1e], you cannot be violating any part of this rule if your feet are on the other side of the hole. That’s because the line of putt ends at the hole [Definition of Line of Putt]. However, you must be careful to actually stroke the ball. If you place your putter right behind the ball and just push it into the hole, you are violating Rule 14-1, which does not permit you to push, scrape, or spoon the ball.
Reaching over the hole to tap the ball in can be helpful in speeding up play during a casual round of golf, but I would not recommend such an unreliable procedure under tournament conditions.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
Situation: Player 'just misses' her putt. She reaches her putter over the hole and taps the ball in the hole. The ball moves toward her, as she has not moved from the side of the hole from which she originally putted. Our Pro says that is OK. Some of us "older" Gals remember that being against the rules. What do you think? Thanks for this and all the other great explanations you have published! Lulu
Dear Lulu,
Your pro is correct, Lulu. While it is true that a player is not permitted to putt a ball while straddling the line of putt (the “line of putt” is the path you expect the ball to take on the way to the hole), or while standing on the line of putt [Rule 16-1e], you cannot be violating any part of this rule if your feet are on the other side of the hole. That’s because the line of putt ends at the hole [Definition of Line of Putt]. However, you must be careful to actually stroke the ball. If you place your putter right behind the ball and just push it into the hole, you are violating Rule 14-1, which does not permit you to push, scrape, or spoon the ball.
Reaching over the hole to tap the ball in can be helpful in speeding up play during a casual round of golf, but I would not recommend such an unreliable procedure under tournament conditions.
Linda
Copyright © 2010 Linda Miller. All rights reserved.
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